SCF Tournament, Round of 32 - Brock Lesnar vs. Eddie Guerrero

[Slyfox696]

The following match is scheduled for one fall. The match is held in Orlando, Florida and is a Round of 32 matchup. All seeds represent overall tournament seeding.



https://steelcageforums.com/tourney/pics/brocklesnar.jpg

https://steelcageforums.com/tourney/pics/eddieguerrero.jpg


#3 Brock Lesnar
vs.
#30 Eddie Guerrero





The discussion period will last for two days, followed by two days for voting. You may vote for whomever you feel deserves to win this match. Please post your reasons below if you wish.

[SSJPhenom]

We've seen this match before and it took an interference from Goldberg for Guerrero to go over. I love Eddie as much as anyone else, but I don't think that he'd beat Lesnar without some sort of shenanigans. If this were a gimmick match a legit argument could be made for Guerrero. Even then, however, I think it'd still go to Lesnar in the end.

Vote Lesnar.

[Spidey]

There are at least four reasons off the top of my head on why Eddie should go over Brock in a fictional tournament.

Eddie beat Lesnar before.
The fight won't be one-sided as seeding suggests. Yes, through interference Eddie won, but what's stopping someone else from interfering in this match to cost Lesnar, too? Like maybe Roman Reigns or any of the other wrestlers in this tournament that either have legit beef with him and/or see themselves as in it for more than the money. It's pro wrestling and dirty finishes are common place. Nobody expects every fight here to be clean, do they? Can't imagine Brock losing clean in any of these matchups, so for Eddie to win again through nefarious means would be plausible.


Eddie cheats like a motherfucker.
Besides Ric Flair, Eddie may be the dirtiest player in this tournament. He's notorious for cheating. Doesn't matter if his opponent is a giant, a vanilla midget, good, bad, etc. he lived by his mantra. To give Brock credit, there were times Paul Heyman stepped in to help Lesnar win, and I can see someone making the argument that Brock himself cheats, but he just doesn't do it often, let alone as often as Eddie did. He was never a thinking man's wrestler. Brock is a lumbering killing machine and he doesn't rely on dirty tactics. He could definitely lose to a crafty, cunning cheater like Guerrero.


This is a David vs. Goliath Match.
Their No Way Out match was even called this. In the world of wrestling, putting up a little guy against a big guy is a David and Goliath story, and often you see David winning. Many wrestlers have made career out of this. It's a feel good moment and fans went nuts when Eddie defeated Lesnar before because Lesnar was billed as Lesnar is always billed, a giant machine and Eddie was of the people. I'd rather go home happy than for a big name like Cena or Austin beating Lesnar. It's sort of guaranteed that they will. But Eddie, the guy that lived and breathed the fans, beating Lesnar actually would mean something.


With reality being more part of storyline than it has in ages, Eddie could be booked to win in 2018 if he were alive.
Every fan of his knew Eddie Guerrero loved the business more than he loved himself. To have Brock Lesnar, who has made no bones about being there just for the money, go over one of the guys that bled pro wrestling is just asking for a ratings drop. It wouldn't make sense for Lesnar to beat Eddie. Brock is Eddie's foil in this situation. If Roman fucking Reigns can get a few cheers just by pointing out the obvious about Lesnar's schedule, imagine how those fans would respond to someone they actually liked.



Vote Eddie so Brock can fuck off to UFC.

[Fallout]

I really appreciate your line of thinking, Spidey, especially since I'm definitely not the biggest Brock fan, and BROCK SMASH arguments really, really irritate me. But if there's ever been a performer that has been overrated in response to his tragic death in terms of impact on the business, it's Eddie Guerrero.

I don't want to sound like a heartless bastard, but the term "glorified midcarder" was made for people like Eddie. He was a fantastic in-ring talent and had a fun character, but it was only after his death that people really started to glorify him to the extent that they do today; I would go as far to say that I would probably favour Miz, Sheamus and Alberto Del Rio above Eddie Guerrero if they were to face off in the tournament. His first world title reign was mediocre even when compared to Benoit's own lacking title reign on Raw, and we'll sadly never know what would have become of his second run. Other than that, he was a midcarder who could always be relied upon to put on a good match, but most definitely not a trailblazer.

Lesnar, for all his faults, was instrumental in one of the most shocking wrestling moments in recorded history, and ran with it, destroying Cena at Summerslam 2014, and only an equally dominant Goldberg feasibly had his number up until this Wrestlemania, where he'll likely lose to Reigns.

I do prefer Eddie Guerrero to Brock Lesnar on a sentimental and personal level, but this is just one of those matches where I can't see Brock logically losing this. The only reason he lost at NWO '04 was because he was on his way out of the company, and they wanted that Goldberg match at Wrestlemania, who was also leaving.

[Spidey]

My argument is not how I perceive the wrestlers on an individual basis. Both men are severely overrated in my honest opinion.

My argument is that Eddie can beat Brock Lesnar in a match therefore he should get the vote.

Though I am glad you brought up Eddie winning because Lesnar was on his way out the door. Lesnar finds himself in that same compromising situation tomorrow. He should totally lose again for this tournament since he'll be leaving WWE for UFC. Talk about symmetry.

Just another reason to vote for Eddie.

[Fallout]

My argument is that Eddie can beat Brock Lesnar in a match therefore he should get the vote.

Though I am glad you brought up Eddie winning because Lesnar was on his way out the door. Lesnar finds himself in that same compromising situation tomorrow. He should totally lose again for this tournament since he'll be leaving WWE for UFC. Talk about symmetry.

Just another reason to vote for Eddie.

To quote the title of Randy Savage's theme, Eddie won that match because of pomp and circumstance.

I remember a few years ago, there was a pretty big argument I was involved in advocating that Mark Henry should beat Benoit, and one of the common rebuttals I got was "Well, Benoit beat Henry in 2004." It's not fair to compare 2004 Henry with prime Benoit, in the same way that it's not fair to compare prime Eddie with Lesnar on his way out, there was no way Lesnar was going to win with the knowledge we have. For the sake of the tournament, we look at wrestlers in their primes, it's why Bruno's in this tournament and not Ivan Koloff, as well as why arguments like "Hogan lost to Jay Leno" and "Cena lost to Kevin Federline" don't appear.

Even if you're looking from an entirely kayfabe point of view, Lesnar's destruction of John Cena and the Streak alone outweigh anything Eddie did in his WWE career in terms of legacy. Prime Eddie would be lucky to get a house show match against 2014 Lesnar, which is what I consider to be Lesnar's prime.

[Spidey]

To quote the title of Randy Savage's theme, Eddie won that match because of pomp and circumstance.

It's wrestling. Doesn't matter who, what, when, where, and why. Eddie won the match. He did it because...is kinda irrelevant.


I remember a few years ago, there was a pretty big argument I was involved in advocating that Mark Henry should beat Benoit, and one of the common rebuttals I got was "Well, Benoit beat Henry in 2004." It's not fair to compare 2004 Henry with prime Benoit, in the same way that it's not fair to compare prime Eddie with Lesnar on his way out, there was no way Lesnar was going to win with the knowledge we have. For the sake of the tournament, we look at wrestlers in their primes, it's why Bruno's in this tournament and not Ivan Koloff, as well as why arguments like "Hogan lost to Jay Leno" and "Cena lost to Kevin Federline" don't appear.

It's completely fair to compare because-

1. His leaving was entirely on him. He wants (present tense) to pursue things outside of wrestling, which doesn't gain him favor in a wrestling tournament.

2. People absolutely bring up the worst of a wrestler's career if it helps their point. Austin being a wife beater is brought up constantly.



Even if you're looking from an entirely kayfabe point of view, Lesnar's destruction of John Cena and the Streak alone outweigh anything Eddie did in his WWE career in terms of legacy.

Again, not comparing the individual achievements. Why the hell would I do that in a Tournament? May as well just cut out the middle man and give us the two biggest names in pro wrestling if we're playing on those terms, which I'm all for, but for now I like to pretend guys like Eddie and Randy Savage have a shot. Let me dream.

No, my vote is for who would beat the other in a match. That's it. No bells or whistles. Eddie has done it before, he cheats a lot, he's playing David to Lesnar's Goliath, and it's a ratings disaster for the hardworking wrestler of the people to lose against the super duper part-timer who is here for the money. These are why I'm siding with Eddie. If you want to pick my reasons apart, I welcome that, but please don't make this a "who's done more" argument. That's boring and like I said kinda narrows this Tournament down to like 2 potential winners, maybe 3.



Prime Eddie would be lucky to get a house show match against 2014 Lesnar, which is what I consider to be Lesnar's prime.

Prime Eddie would be lucky to get a match with 2014 Lesnar just because Lesnar will maybe do like 3 that year with little fan fare.

EDIT: Just checked. He wrestled 4 matches, not 3. That's considered his prime??

[Gazprom]

Eddie Guerrero is overrated, but he hasn't ever diminished my interest in professional wrestling. I stopped watching WWE regularly in 2002 and 2012. Guess when Lesnar came into and returned to the company?