"Downplaying mental illness" this was the guy who has had to have time off due to mental illness so I think he understands now. My fav on the list is "Says del rio only got pushed because he is Mexican:" when Del Rio legit said the only reason he was in WWE was to induct Mil Máscaras. Some of the list says "Ryder's cringeworthy" he fucking is.
Fuck bringing up things from years ago. People change. It's called growing up.
People can say things that are legitimate mistakes without realizing it. Take me and the whole Sonya Deville/"Dyke" comment from earlier this year of which I still feel embarrassment over.
People can change and this stuff was said to have been posted, what? 6 or 7 years ago? Sullivan would've been like 22 or 23 then, still a kid in a lot of ways and could have done a lot of growing up since. If he genuinely believed in the things he said years back and has changed since, then good for him. Unless this still goes on today or reflects upon a pattern of behavior that's occurred in real life over the years, then that might be a different story. A handful of posts to a bodybuilding forum more than half a decade ago, to me, isn't enough to outright condemn a man for the rest of his life. If he still holds those views and keeps them to himself, then it's a shame but it's his right to think and feel that way. Again, if he still has those beliefs or feelings but keeps them all to himself locked within his head, and doesn't let them get in the way of his job, then that may be the best anyone can ask for. After all, if that's really what he believes, then it's only a matter of time before something happens and all the hate comes spilling out.
"What Do I Know Of Cultured Ways, The Gilt, The Craft And The Lie?
I, Who Was Born In A Naked Land And Bred In The Open Sky.
The Subtle Tongue, The Sophist Guile, They Fail When The Broadswords Sing.
Rush In And Die Dogs - I Was A Man Before I Was King."
Conan Of Cimmeria
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People can change, but I'm not sure Lars has. He's handled the situation terribly. See his deleted tweets from 3 weeks ago.Originally Posted by Lee
On board with BSE here. There's an appropriate way to own your mistakes and disown past behaviors but Lars Sullivan has not demonstrated that from what I've seen. When he does so I'll listen. Sure, rando-redditor could have done something better with his time than dig up six year old comments but I'm not interested in talking points about how he's somehow in the wrong for how he spends his time when there's a much bigger elephant in the room.
Latest developments aren't in Lars' favour either. WWE sponsors Snickers (AKA the Moolah Battle Royal Slayer) has corresponded with fans who have voiced displeasure with WWE's quiet dismissal of these comments.
If WWE and Sullivan want to repair this, then I hope they treat it as a learning moment rather than quietly hope it goes away.
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I absolutely get your point, and I think it is fair. It plays into the point I made about showing growth. The issue though is what is the proper way to respond? Does he need to Tweet an apology? Does WWE need to Tweet one? Does he need to film himself doing charity work with like the NAACP? Does he need to donate to a women's rights charity? Do celebrities have to start addressing everything someone on the internet says? I'm not saying these are rumors. It seems fairly clear that Lars said some awful stuff. I just think that society has taken schadenfreude to a weird level with stuff like this.
We no longer care about context or circumstances. And no, that doesn't mean that if in a month we find out that Aleister Black hit Zelina Vega during an argument that it makes it okay. It doesn't mean that if Braun Strowman gets into an argument with a black fan at an airport and calls him 'nigger' that he isn't racist. I just think there needs to be some ability for people to show growth and change.
I get what you're saying. Finding the right response might be a challenge but it's still that's still on him. Take a look at how Rhea Ripley handled her recent Twitch slur. I'm not repeating what she said, but as much as it was an expletive bourne out of frustration, she still recognized what she said was wrong and shared a lengthy apology for hurting people. Not "for offending anyone" as Lars put it. An apology for damage that the word caused. And to your point, there are a lot of people who don't accept her apology, and they're well within their right to feel that way if they no longer support Rhea. But in my books, she recognized the damage, deeply regrets it and wants to undo it. "I'm sorry for offending anyone" is far removed from that.
Much like you Yaz I'm not really on board with canceling anyone indefinitely because I believe that there has to be room to own your worst selves and grow past them. But I'm also very resolved in not giving out that forgiveness freely. I can't speak for those who are taking schadenfreude in this, that's certainly not me (nor did I think you were pointing the finger at me, just to clarify), but I know Lars won't have any of my support for the time being.
I totally forgot about the Ripley issue, but yeah she was right on that apology, which I think did a lot to keep the damage contained. By no means do I think people need to simply forgive Lars or just forget he said stuff, not that I think anyone thinks I was suggesting that, rather I think they need to refrain from slapping certain labels on people so quickly. There are certain actions that are unforgivable, and that's fair. Take Hogan for example. He said what he said well into his 60s, at that age it is extremely unlikely his views will change. I will likely never not view Hogan as racist. Lars can come out tomorrow and give overwhelming proof he doesn't believe the things he said, and there will be people who don't forgive him. Like you said, that is their right. We do need to allow him, and others, the opportunity to apologize and change though. It seems that has been lost on people.
As far as the schadenfreude, I do think it being Lars, a guy the IWC tends to view as generic big man #659, plays into it. Punk called a fan a gay slur once, and it was caught on tape, and no one cared. Turned out Punk was a giant penis in the end, but I have some doubt that if a more popular star said what Lars had said if fans would have made it as big a deal.
And I'm with you. I'm not gonna be rooting for Lars to succeed anytime soon.
Oh yeah, to be clear I don't think you are choosing to ignore this, that was meant as my observation towards how Lars and WWE look to handle it. I should have been more clear.
You have a point about Punk. To be fair I recall him showing empathy towards his actions and what seemed like appreciation to those who called him out when he apologised. But I'm sure he was protected by the Internet Darling shield from that blowback. There are definitely people in our fandom who treating one star better than other stars for unfavourable behavior
Rhea, Bianca, Mandy, Tiffany, and Raquel featuring Scarlett
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It's something.
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